Help with use of insulin/carbs to sustain moderate to strenuous exercise without crazy highs and lows

@bostrav59 That was scary! Yes, I always keep some glucose handy, even just for a short walk into town! Man, though, what a wonderful bike trip!! Around that same time I was traveling/hiking in France, too, in the Pyrenees area.

@CarlosLuis thank you for your training comments. I’m still using my indoor trainer with Rouvy and do enjoy it. I thank you so much for your help in figuring it all out! I am trying to get back into running, too, but my knee is not fully recovered. I can run distance but so, so slow. Still, I am grateful to just being able to do it!

@Eric Yes, I learned carbs + insulin = performance from you, Eric! Before getting your help I was constantly tired, and even had to take a nap sometimes after a run! I didn’t realize I was just draining my energy from running and never recuperating due to carb restriction. I followed all of your suggested here in FUD, esp DM’s swimming thread, but all of your posts have been so helpful! Thank you!!

@Quadgirl I use an Apple Watch 4, with iPhone SE 2nd gen, and can view BGs on watch w/out any issue. The iPhone has to be within bluetooth range of the watch though. I also use a Garmin Fenix, and it, too, displays the Dexcom BGs. The Apple Watch is much easier to view though with its crisp resolution.

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Yes, of course! This can work too.

Really, the whole thing with carbs and insulin is just the timing of it.

Different carb/foods get metabolized with different speeds. So you just have to find the right combination of which food and what time. And it depends on the circumstances of the day.

Do NOT get caught up in the idea of always doing the same thing at the same number of minutes before. It will depend on what is happening with your BG at the time.

There is no formula. It’s more about learning the process.

Again, same as above. It’s all about the speed of delivery.

Sometimes you need faster carbs though. So have some fast stuff with you too.

Take what makes sense. A slow drop is one type of carb, a fast drop is a different type of carb.

I think any Apple Watch will let you install the Dexcom app and see your BG (as long as the phone is with you too!). I know the Apple SE version of the watch allows that.

I am not sure about weight training entries though. I suggest creating a thread with just that single question. I am sure someone here will know.

It depends on where are you comfortable.

First of all, a BG test is going to give you a more accurate real time number. I know you don’t like this. If you were swimming or bicycling you couldn’t do a BG check. But on a walk you certainly can.

But if you are going off your CGM, it just depends on how fast you are dropping. Where are you going to be 10 minutes from now? Try to fix that number.

Treat a rapid drop more aggressively, and a slower drop you can be more conservative.

It just takes practice to know where you can be. I don’t think below 70 is a horror-show. I don’t even think 60 is a big deal. I just think it depends on how fast it is happening.

How about trying to get comfortable with putting a tiny little baby lancet in your finger and getting a small dab of blood out of it? That can give you success.

Try to work toward this. :wink:
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In the summer when it is hot (well this is Texas) I sometimes see a drop that doesn’t relate to how I am feeling or performing on the bike. Often a finger stick will show a much higher BG than Dexcom. My thinking is that even with good hydration, drinking plenty of water, the interstitial fluids can become dehydrated. Sweat glands draw off the water in the interstitial layer.

I found a study of exercise on the accuracy of Dexcom, but like a lot of these things it was not, in my opinion, done long enough to be conclusive. I forget the duration of exercise, iirc it was 30 minutes. The results showed good correlation between blood glucose and interstitial glucose levels. I think the exercise should have been at least 60 minutes at 75° F with lots of air movement.

Just a hypothesis on my part from my personal experience.

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@CarlosLuis, yes I agree with all of what you said there! :arrow_up:

Besides hydration, the issue for me is the delay between CGM and the real-time number.

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:grinning: Thank-you, @trying! Your watch is the one I am wanting to get, so that is good info. Yay!

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Thanks for letting me know. I was unclear - but did know I would have to have phone as well. Thanks for being thorough.

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@Eric Thanks for each of the above. I am beginning to get the idea and will try different scenarios and find what works. I think I never knew how hard it would be to unlearn things that worked on mdi, but don’t with pump. The mystery algorithm can be a challenge, but I am getting closer every day! And I do always have fast-acting on me. Great help as always!

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It should be easier on a pump. You can treat it the same, except that you get to turn off basal with the pump. That should make it easier.

The only downside can be insulin infusion issues with a pump. But you can work around that by using injections for larger doses.

And I’d suggest banning that “mystery algorithm” for any times when you are awake and can manually check and adjust.

It’’s fine if you are sleeping or driving or in the theater, etc.

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Thanks, @Eric. Makes sense. I just posted a question to @mremmers about trying out manual and how to go about setting up a basal rate to start with that won’t land me low. I am inching closer to manual use. And today, ate 1/2 banana at start of walk, with .4IOB, ate 1 glucose tab about 1.4 miles in, got to 0IOB about 2.2 miles in, having dropped to 119, level and begun at 138, and both turned insulin back on and gave suggested correction dose from automated at mile 3.4, finished 4.5 very fast walk at 109, waited a bit, then bolused for breakfast and so far, all is well! I will keep experimenting based on different exertion levels, heat about to descend on us (my bg rises in heat), and different carb forms, and different IOb at start. Progress is happening - geez - except I need to go check with finger stick - I am down to 95, feel it in a not good way, and still have 3 units on board from breakfast. I posted in a separate thread about feeling changing my glucose range down to 70-140 has created lots more microboluses and amounts. Probably in jy head, but do you think if I am getting right amount of basal, I may need to change I/C ratios? My very usual breakfast contents and timing after exercise. Curious. Thanks again, Eric - let me go hurt my finger. . .
Laura

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Okay - just fyi - finger stick showed 90. Then 10 minutes later I get 75 and falling alarm on dex - go check and I am75 on finger stick. (My record for number of fingersticks so close together). I just had 3.3 carbs of cvs brand pedialyte (different amt. of carbs per ounce, btw, than name brand). Will hope I don’t have to test again. So - any other reason for this post breakfast low? I bolused at7:58 for breakfast of 3 eggs, 2 dave’s thin cinnamon toast with stevia in the raw, and a 16 carb Kind bar. 90% of time this is my breakfast. Waited 10 minute pre-bolus, finished eating at 8:30. Then all this by 9:45. Could it just be a small adjustment of some sort needed? Anyway, to allay my probably wrong-headed idea about the algorithm acting differently with tighter glucose goal range, I did just put it back to 70-150. Well crap - now dex says 69 and falling. Really want to wait it out and not eat more. Yay - right after alarm sounded it went to 79 and level. I hate drama. Also, by the way, I just looked at my Notes and I change the range on Friday of last week and I’ve had these issues of having to tend small loads like this since then. Or it could just be after the reset that my pods are getting more efficient but the settings I’ve put in are now wrong. Alright - probably oversharing as I grapple with all these nuances. Please chime in if there are any experiences/opinions/ideas you may have for me. Maybe I did not need the pedialyte? Well, at least if was very few carbs. I just do not want a roller coaster. Now have 1.6 units IOB. If 3 hour duration is sort of right😜. Cannot wait to get dialed in, and with manual, so I can graduate to looping as a smarter person. Right now, I just want set and forget for the most part because I want to live better. Tomorrow is 84 degrees trip to South Carolina’s low country for some walking in cypress forest. Will be prepared for everything! Thanks for listening.
Laura

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@Quadgirl I know people probably get tired of me suggesting this book by type 1 athlete Sheri Colberg PhD, FACSM, “THE Athletes Guide to Diabetes.”

This book gave me a really good understanding of how glucose is metabolized and how understanding this can help both type 1 and 2 diabetics with how physical activities can affect blood glucose levels. She then covers the use of insulin, oral and injectable drugs. This is the first half of the book. Part 2 is consists of the stories of a lot of athletes of different disciplines and what they do to perform well while maintaining healthy blood glucose levels.

If I were a certified diabetes educator I would use this book with my patients. But alas, I am just a self taught type 2 diabetic.

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Thanks @CarlosLuis! I am glad you persisted. Sounds just like what I need. I will scout it out for sure!

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