# Oops, I did a dumb thing **URL:** \ **Category:** New T1/LADA\ **Tags:** carb-counting, bolus\ **Created:** [October 22, 2017, 9:51pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424 "2017-10-22T21:51:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 12:23am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/21 "2017-10-23T00:23:33Z")
Several have mentioned doing this - do you just bolus whenever you figure out the “exact” carb count? Or once you start eating? ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 12:33am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/22 "2017-10-23T00:33:40Z")
That’s great idea for a thread. We could post pictures of meals and play “count those carbs”. I think you’d be amazed how different all of our counts would be for the same plate of food… why? Because we’re “counting” based on our own experience and not in a strictly mathematical sense ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 12:50am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/23 "2017-10-23T00:50:47Z")
> [@Pianoplayer7008](#): > > Just to clarify, the dumb thing was just guessing at what I’d need to bolus before I really thought about what was in the meal. To me that’s not dumb. That’s pretty much every meal. ---
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 1:48am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/24 "2017-10-23T01:48:54Z")
Yeah, well, as @daisymae keeps trying to tell everyone, you’re not really a d; you’re a spy, so… 😉 On a serious note, I hope to get to that point someday, but I doubt my type a personality is ever going to let me just “guess” at something like this - at least for an entire meal. I already do guess based on experiences with a few things. Maybe I should trust my instincts, though. 104 pre-meal, 102 @1hr, 116@2hrs, And 96@3hrs. I don’t know how it happened, but I’ll take it. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 2:12am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/25 "2017-10-23T02:12:39Z")
> [@Pianoplayer7008](#): > > Maybe I should trust my instincts, though. 104 pre-meal, 102 @1hr, 116@2hrs, And 96@3hrs. I don’t know how it happened, but I’ll take it. Bolus calculators are also a guess. Your guess is just a better guess! Learn to develop that skill. Take a guess before you plug in carb numbers. See how close you were. Were you higher or lower? Why? Eventually you will learn to trust yourself more than a formula. ---
**Author:** ![Irish](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/irish/32/57_2.png) [@Irish](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Irish)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 2:34am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/26 "2017-10-23T02:34:57Z")
> [@Sam](#): > > We could post pictures of meals and play “count those carbs”. I think you’d be amazed how different all of our counts would be for the same plate of food… why? Because we’re “counting” based on our own experience and not in a strictly mathematical sense I totally agree here! And, while I’ve never taken a dose of afrezza, neither have I ever weighed a meal (don’t even own a food scale, though I know I’m in a distinct minority here with this). Estimating and trial and error is about all I do. And sometimes I bolus completely dofferent amounts for the same carb count, depending on several factors. So glad it worked out for you tonight! ---
**Author:** ![cardamom](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/cardamom/32/2622_2.png) [@cardamom](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/cardamom)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 1:23pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/27 "2017-10-23T13:23:58Z")
> [@Thomas](#): > > Make your best guess for the minimum number of carbs the meal is likely to have and pre-bolus that. Follow-up with a bolus for more carbs when your approximation gets refined. This is what I do—whether I take the second shot before or after I eat depends on several factors—when I feel confident I’ll know everything I’m eating, how carb-heavy vs fat/protein-heavy the meal is (for the latter, I feel comfortable waiting for after the meal, and may not prebolus at all if it’s very low carb), etc. As someone watching my weight, I try not to overdo the insulin and eat to match—I think if your weight is not a concern, that’s the easiest method diabetes-control-wise, but it can result in consuming calories when you don’t otherwise want or need them. ---
**Author:** ![Chris](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/chris/32/382_2.png) [@Chris](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Chris)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 3:42pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/28 "2017-10-23T15:42:31Z")
> [@Pianoplayer7008](#): > > On a serious note, I hope to get to that point someday, but I doubt my type a personality is ever going to let me just “guess” at something like this Well then I am assuming you won’t be eating out?? Every time we eat out it is an adventure in guess the hidden carbs. Sure, you can do your best, by substituting the mash for a vegetable, and get the fish or pork chop, but in the end it all comes down to a guess. My son is now pretty good about guessing at the start, and then “feeling” if he ingested more carbs and adjusting his dose. This comes down to how sweet did the sauce taste, how filling everything is, and understanding the ingredients. Give it some time, and your “guesses” will get much better than they are now. ---
**Author:** ![TiaG](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/tiag/32/594_2.png) [@TiaG](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/TiaG)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/29 "2017-10-23T15:46:10Z")
non starchy veggies are so negligible usually I would just employ a wait-and-see approach. ---
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 4:44pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/30 "2017-10-23T16:44:14Z")
> [@Irish](#): > > Estimating and trial and error is about all I do. It makes me nervous to do that, mostly just because I haven’t experienced a true low (and thus gotten through it to know I’ll probably be ok it that happens). Particularly since I’m a SAHM and have an infant depending on me for food. > [@Chris](#): > > Well then I am assuming you won’t be eating out?? Ha, I do rarely eat out because of the celiac issue, and when I do, I use some of my Afrezza stash - no carb guessing needed. 😃 > [@TiaG](#): > > non starchy veggies are so negligible Yep, that’s why it’s worried me - I knew the carb count of the rice, could guess the count of the stew, and I knew those combined with the small carb count of the veggies wasn’t going to equal what I normally would eat when I’d dosed 2us! Somehow it worked out, and hopefully will shortly as I eat the same thing for lunch. 😊 ---
**Author:** ![Thomas](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/thomas/32/1719_2.png) [@Thomas](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Thomas)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2017, 4:57pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/31 "2017-10-23T16:57:42Z")
> [@Pianoplayer7008](#): > > It makes me nervous to do that, mostly just because I haven’t experienced a true low (and thus gotten through it to know I’ll probably be ok it that happens). May seem odd advice, but I would suggest to have a controlled experiment on going low. If you accept the fact that it is going to happen sooner or later why not have it happen under a controlled set of circumstances when you have support around in case you need assistance? Each low can be different but if you have never experienced a low at all - it might help you feel a bit more at ease to get the first one under your belt? ---
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 12:47pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/32 "2017-10-24T12:47:02Z")
That’s pretty good (though does feel a little crazy) idea. I’m pretty scared of lows, so even the thought of deliberately inducing one in a controlled situation sounds scary, so we’ll soon how soon I’m able to push myself to do that (and convince my husband it’s a good idea lol!). ---
**Author:** ![katiereeder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e79b87/32.png) [@katiereeder](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/katiereeder)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 4:47pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/33 "2017-10-24T16:47:59Z")
We definitely use the “minimum prebolus” technique with my son, especially at breakfast when he likes to pre bolus on rolling out of bed and then have the freedom to choose his breakfast afterward. So he frequently boluses for 50 gm and then boluses any additional carbs right before eating. To me, the point of pre bolusing isn’t to get every smidge of your insulin in advance, but to have at least some at hit peak activity by the time the carbs start to be digested to smooth out the prandial spike. I haven’t noticed that splitting affects how well the prebolus works. Now if only we could accomplish pre boluses during the 20 minute school lunch (sigh). Our go to addition if he’s over bolused is a glass of milk, but I can see how that would be less fun than the donut plan 😀. Don’t think I’ll share that with him! ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 5:43pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/34 "2017-10-24T17:43:27Z")
> [@Pianoplayer7008](#): > > I’m pretty scared of lows, so even the thought of deliberately inducing one in a controlled situation sounds scary, so we’ll soon how soon I’m able to push myself to do that (and convince my husband it’s a good idea lol!). Remember getting your driver’s license and first practicing in a parking lot where there was no traffic and it was safe. You did that a few times before going out in the street. And you didn’t drive alone, you had a licensed driver in the car next to you. You know at some point you are going to have a low. It just comes with the territory. If the first time is under controlled circumstances, it is much better. And also having someone there to help you. Imagine your first low being when you are alone! I urge you to consider this as a priority. ---
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 6:02pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/35 "2017-10-24T18:02:20Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > I urge you to consider this as a priority. Thanks. I’m considering that today as my son is making it difficult for me to eat properly on time. ---
**Author:** ![Chris](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/chris/32/382_2.png) [@Chris](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Chris)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 7:48pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/36 "2017-10-24T19:48:16Z")
As you gain experience, you will begin to see the symptoms that are built into you. For example, in my son, if he is having a bad low (\<50) he will have small tremors in his hands that he can’t control even when asked to focus on it. For him that is an easy double check when his sensor says he is low, but it has snuck up on him and he doesn’t feel it yet. Or when we have treated but his sensor hasn’t caught up, and he is actually at 90. My guess is that once you trial it, you won’t be so frightened. The horror stories are just that, they don’t happen with every low, but they make good conversations. ---
**Author:** ![daisymae](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/daisymae/32/1199_2.png) [@daisymae](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/daisymae)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/37 "2017-10-24T21:07:28Z")
> [@Sam](#): > > I think you’d be amazed how different all of our counts would be for the same plate of food… why? Because we’re “counting” based on our own experience and not in a strictly mathematical sense i love this. for too many years i would get into an very heated argument with my endo about how i need to bolus for proteins and fats; i insisted that i did need to and he insisted that i shouldn’t. i am a 53 yr old D and have been D for 30+ yrs. i know my body by now. (boy was he an idiot endo; so thankful i finally found another one) i learned on this site that YDMV. and its 100% true. identify, but don’t compare. you’re body will tell you what it needs. just pay attention. ---
**Author:** ![cardamom](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/cardamom/32/2622_2.png) [@cardamom](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/cardamom)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2017, 12:42pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/38 "2017-10-25T12:42:05Z")
The practicing a low is a great idea. You probably won’t have to go very low to start feeling symptoms—I’d target about maybe -10 from your current lowest blood sugar if possible (so if your target range is 80-120, try for about 70, maybe 65, if you can), and see how that goes (of course you may miss the mark) and feels, and then if that’s where you land, take a very small amount of fast acting carbs (might only need 5g or so), and wait about 20-30 min and see what happens in terms of how you feel/what your blood sugar does. If you go lower than that, might need more carbs to start (15g is the standard low blood sugar treatment, but I know I and I believe many of us aiming for tight control find it to be too much often and too little occasionally, like when you have lots of insulin still on board or a really stubborn low). If only going down that much doesn’t _feel_ low, you might try going a little lower in your next experiment (I’m suggesting a semi-low to start, since I think it would be easier and less anxiety provoking). ---
**Author:** ![Pianoplayer7008](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/pianoplayer7008/32/1507_2.png) [@Pianoplayer7008](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Pianoplayer7008)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2017, 12:43am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/39 "2017-10-26T00:43:46Z")
I should clarify that I’ve been in the 50s before (my range I prefer to stay in is 70-120). It’s just that so far they’ve all been so easy to deal with, the possibility of a bad low makes me nervous, so that’s probably what I’ll have to address. And yeah, 15g carbs sounds like a lot. When I “corrected” with an 18 carb ice cream bar while pregnant (haha), it would get me in the 120s, easily, if not higher (from 50s/60s). I’ve since learned to use things like gummy bears or jelly beans that are much smaller carb count! ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2017, 1:11am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424/40 "2017-10-26T01:11:20Z")
If you’ve been in the 50s that counts… lows generally aren’t that tough to handle unless they really blindside you and you end up at like 20 or something… mild lows are a fact of life for a lot of people, and major lows are pretty avoidable these days… particularly if you’re eating reasonably clean and not requiring massive wild ass guesses with bolus insulin [Previous page](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/oops-i-did-a-dumb-thing/2424.md?page=3)