# How to use 70/30 **URL:** \ **Category:** Insulin\ **Created:** [September 14, 2017, 1:59am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981 "2017-09-14T01:59:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:59am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/1 "2017-09-14T01:59:42Z")
70/30 is among the insulins available without rx for only $25 / vial. What would be a good baseline protocol in an emergency to survive on 70/30? I’m assuming that most people don’t have an indefinite supply of strips laying around— so let’s do a little role playing exercise— imagine you have 10 vials of 70/30 in your fridge. You’ve never used it. You’re used to all the latest and greatest MDI and pumps, cgm, whatever. To make it interesting let’s say you only have 100 test strips on hand. A disaster strikes and you have no access to more insulin or more test strips… how do you manage ? As 70/30 is one of the affordable options that we can afford to build an emergency stockpile with it is a good idea to have some idea how to put it into use if we ever needed to. Good to think these things through in advance… ---
**Author:** ![Michel](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/michel/32/387_2.png) [@Michel](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Michel)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:13am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/2 "2017-09-14T02:13:22Z")
> [@Sam](#): > > 70/30 is among the insulins available without rx for only $25 / vial. @Sam, do you have a reason why, of all cheap OTC insulins, you would use 70/30? ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:38am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/3 "2017-09-14T02:38:49Z")
Just for the ultimate in simplicity-- I believe this is the preferred protocol in many less developed parts of the world still where resources are limited, so it seems like it might be a worthwhile backup plan. ---
**Author:** ![Michel](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/michel/32/387_2.png) [@Michel](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Michel)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 2:49am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/4 "2017-09-14T02:49:36Z")
> [@Sam](#): > > Good to think these things through in advance… Are you thinking zombie apocalypse/ end of civilization/ global warming catastrophe? This is a dire case for PWDs with no happy ending I think. 70/30 may not get us out of there. ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:07am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/5 "2017-09-14T03:07:58Z")
Any situation where the supply chain to your preferred insulin and test strips breaks down and you are stuck relying on a stockpile that you could afford to build and maintain in advance… ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:30am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/6 "2017-09-14T03:30:00Z")
For 70/30: If you have sufficient food, take a dose that corresponds to the 70% matching 1/3 of your normal total daily basal. And take it 3 times a day, 8 hours apart. Like 8am, 4pm, 12am Example: If your normal basal is 30, you take 14.0-14.5 units of the mix, 3 times a day. Less at night if you don’t want to eat during the night. For a basal of 30/day, the calculation is: (30 / 3) /.7 = 14.29 units. You can see that doing that 3 times gives you about 30 units of basal and 12.8 units of bolus insulin. You are not eating meals, you are grazing. You eat to the insulin. Provided you have sufficient food, you just graze and eat to your dosing. If low you eat a little bit. If high, you don’t eat until your BG comes down, or it is time for your next dose. That is if you think this thing ends soon. Doing it like that keeps you alive 7.5 months. If I think the apocalypse lasts longer, I cut that dose in half or in thirds, and then I am eating minimal amounts. And I try to obtain a centrifuge, sulfuric acid, alcohol, filter paper, and pigs, cows, goats, or sheep so I can make my own insulin. ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:39am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/7 "2017-09-14T05:39:09Z")
Why 7.5 months? I’d try to keep a substantially longer stockpile than that, and I think any insulin someone like you or I could make ourselves would be incomprehensibly crude and an infinitely poorer option than 70/30… ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 5:41am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/8 "2017-09-14T05:41:18Z")
I just said 7.5 months because in the example I gave, with your scenario of 10 vials, it would only last 7.5 months. I could get longer out of 10 vials myself, but I was using the 30 units of basal guy as the example. If I knew it was long term, I would be the low-carb king… ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 6:05am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/9 "2017-09-14T06:05:41Z")
Some interesting topics I’ve seen discussed about how much carb intake will really matter with insulin usage over the long run,… if you went ultra LC do you think your insulin sensitivity would change so that eventually you’d be using more than a directly proportional amount? I notice when I work in different environments with different diets for a few weeks… if I eat more carbs I seem to become more bolus sensitive, when I eat less carbs I eventually require more bolus to cover them,… ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 6:15am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/10 "2017-09-14T06:15:35Z")
I don’t know from personal experience, because I have never done low carb, other than an occasional day. Never long term. ---
**Author:** ![TravelingOn](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/travelingon/32/1583_2.png) [@TravelingOn](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/TravelingOn)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 7:08am UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/11 "2017-09-14T07:08:30Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > If I think the apocalypse lasts longer, I cut that dose in half or in thirds, and then I am eating minimal amounts. And I try to obtain a centrifuge, sulfuric acid, alcohol, filter paper, and pigs, cows, goats, or sheep so I can make my own insulin. Dude, tears, running down my face. I swear FUDiabetes makes the best bedtime stories. So funny. (Except for the sad ones, but this zombie apocalypse thing is funny!) And I thought I was doing okay with a modest food and water and insulin stockpile! Ha! ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 1:41pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/12 "2017-09-14T13:41:34Z")
> [@TravelingOn](#): > > And I thought I was doing okay with a modest food and water and insulin stockpile! Ha! You mean you don’t have a supply of farm animal pancreases and a centrifuge to make your own insulin?! ---
**Author:** ![TravelingOn](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/travelingon/32/1583_2.png) [@TravelingOn](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/TravelingOn)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 3:55pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/13 "2017-09-14T15:55:15Z")
I have chickens, but I don’t think their pancreases are up for the job! I will keep pressuring @EricH for more animals for my mini farm. I do think that the city would object though. ---
**Author:** ![Michel](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/michel/32/387_2.png) [@Michel](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Michel)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 4:07pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/14 "2017-09-14T16:07:32Z")
> [@Eric](#): > > you don’t have a supply of farm animal pancreases and a centrifuge to make your own insulin?! Oh, @TravelingOn, for G\_d’s sake, you are SO underequipped for this task. ---
**Author:** ![Eric](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/eric/32/9209_2.png) [@Eric](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Eric)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 8:31pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/15 "2017-09-14T20:31:47Z")
> [@TravelingOn](#): > > I have chickens, but I don’t think their pancreases are up for the job! Yeah, you really want to use mammal pancreases. Trust me, I learned that the hard way. ---
**Author:** ![Sam](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/sam/32/10595_2.png) [@Sam](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 8:43pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/16 "2017-09-14T20:43:39Z")
I could procure virtually unlimited moose… ---
**Author:** ![Chris](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/chris/32/382_2.png) [@Chris](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Chris)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:22pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/17 "2017-09-14T21:22:23Z")
You would need unlimited moose to support your insulin habit: According to the article in Diabetes Forecast, more than two tons of pig parts were needed to extract just eight ounces of purified insulin. ![image](https://canada1.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/uploads/fudiabetes/original/2X/1/15b5333e87922772c1a12e885beca98cb861ad4b.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![TravelingOn](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/travelingon/32/1583_2.png) [@TravelingOn](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/TravelingOn)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:45pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/18 "2017-09-14T21:45:59Z")
> [@Chris](#): > > Two tons of pig parts were needed to extract just eight ounces of purified insulin. I’m thankful we had pork chops for dinner last night! Adding to the supply of spare parts. > [@Sam](#): > > I could procure virtually unlimited moose… Maybe moose pancreai are larger? ---
**Author:** ![Chris](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/chris/32/382_2.png) [@Chris](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/Chris)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:52pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/19 "2017-09-14T21:52:05Z")
> [@TravelingOn](#): > > Maybe moose pancreai are larger? True, you will have to harvest less pancreases to get to the 2 tons, but you are still going to need two tons. Probably only going to work for those that run a slaughterhouse post-apocalypse. ---
**Author:** ![TravelingOn](https://yyz2.discourse-cdn.com/flex030/user_avatar/forum.fudiabetes.org/travelingon/32/1583_2.png) [@TravelingOn](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/u/TravelingOn)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2017, 9:58pm UTC](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981/20 "2017-09-14T21:58:36Z")
> [@Chris](#): > > Probably only going to work for those that run a slaughterhouse post-apocalypse. If anyone had asked me three months ago if I thought I’d ever be having a conversation about moose pancreases, prepping for a zombie apocalypse by getting a slaughterhouse, popover recipes, carb counting, inhalable insulin, and how to trick a BG meter, I certainly would have said no. Wouldn’t trade you guys in for anything though! [Next page](https://forum.fudiabetes.org/t/how-to-use-70-30/1981.md?page=2)