Basal Discussion Deep Dive for Everyone

Does it change your prebolus timing for meals?

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Yes. Like down to zero.
:grinning:

I mean really, if I am dropping before a meal, I don’t need any pre-b time. So an hour or two before the meal, if I can hold off on any correction snacks, I can hit that bolus button and start eating right away.

The only exception is for super sweet things. I still pre-b for that.

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Thank you. That’s super helpful. I’ve been struggling with figuring out that part. Will give it a whirl!

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Here it is again… Sorry to pick out something not core to the thread, but I’ve been looking for this explanation.

Which would probably be you, Eric… But maybe tomorrow. So you can go rest your weary brain. :smiley:

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By the way, @T1Allison, excellent thread. Printing and reading. :smiley:

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There are a lot of things in this thread that can anwser your question.

What is the difference between taking 0.5 units when you are flat at 100, and flat at 300? If you are at 100, maybe 1/2 a unit drops you. But if you are at 300, it might not even make a dent.

Look at the part about GSK3 phosphorylating glycogen synthase. That is your medical answer.

Think about how a small amount of water puts out a single match (before the fire has grown) versus how much it takes to put out the big forest fire. That is your analogy.

But it is so easy to see from personal experience.

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@T1Allison

Trying to put together some thoughts on this topic. Why does insulin work so much better when you have a background of basal insulin?

I have touched on this before, but here are some continued general thoughts on the subject. I have not worked this out into a coherent post, but wanted to put them down so I don’t forget the thoughts I had.

Walk through the thoughts and see if they make sense. It helps me to go slowly though the concepts and get my mind wrapped around it.

When insulin is absent, your body interprets that as not eating. Since for the non-D, eating means insulin will appear, this makes sense. No insulin means there must not be any food. And if there is no food, the body does not want to store glucose. Instead it wants to use glucose that is available in the blood. Not storing it, but instead using it!

When there is insulin present in your body, your body senses that it is in a “fed state”. Because insulin is release when you eat, your body determines that insulin being present means food is also present, so you must be in a “fed state”.

When in a “fed state” your body will try to store some of that for later - “I have food now, so I need to bank some of that food for later”. The process that happens when you are in a “fed state” is called glycogenesis - the conversion of glucose into stored glycogen.

So when insulin is present, your body is adept at storing glucose. Storing glucose means that glucose goes from your blood into the storage form in your skeletal muscle and liver.

A strong basal - to your body - means “I have insulin, so that means I must have food. Since I have food now, I can store it…”

The difference then - when you have a strong basal running - is that your body is going to take available glucose in your blood and tuck it away into storage. That makes the glucose in your blood more likely to be removed faster and more efficiently. So the stuff you eat will be more likely to be stored than remain available for use.

Sorry, this is just a rambling post. Let’s explore this at some time and see if we can make it coherent.

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If this is your version of an incoherent post, @Eric, then what do the rest of us sound like?

That all makes perfect sense. I appreciate your explanation. I had not thought about it like that before.

I’m assuming that my body needing more insulin when I’m sedentary at work is not necessarily a function of fed vs non-fed state as much as it is an efficiency problem? Although in saying that now…I know my basal rates are accurate in a non-fed state…so I’ll need to keep rolling that one around. The delta between how much extra basal I need in a “fed” state on sedentary work days compared to active weekends is noticeable…so maybe it’s both (fed state vs non-fed state, plus efficiency of my body). Will keep thinking on this…

Thanks for posting.

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Don’t think of a fed-state in terms of eating.

In the non-D:
eating = insulin = “fed state”

For us, it is different. Having sufficient insulin makes the body think it is in a fed state, and the resulting storage that takes place.

We can make our body think we are in a fed state, regardless of whether we are eating or not eating. Simply by taking insulin.

In the non-D, food always means insulin! And insulin always means food. The two are always together.

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I am late to the party and just reading through this thread. The discussion has given me a lot to think about in terms of some recent episodes of dawn phenomenon. :+1:t3:

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